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Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickly))

Discussion of all aspects of the TV show - the faltering novelization, the comics, the art, the new canon, the games, etc.

Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickly))

Postby silentmajority » Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:50 pm

I'm going to don my GRRiMlin hat for a moment because I haven't heard anyone suggesting this. GRRiMlin hat by the way, also happens to be known as a Chicago Cubs hat. Cubs blow but yet, Cub fans always seems to see the light at the end of the tunnel. It's barely been a hundred years since they won a World Series, they're frickin' awesome!!!

Back on topic. Here is why the HBO series will speed up George's writing skills. We'll start here. The more money people make the more they spend, the more they spend the more debt they accumulate, the further in debt they fall the more money they need. Going along that line of thinking, all the royalties that George gets from his novels, and his past TV ventures probably aren't enough to pay all his bills.

Enter the Wild Card novels, and the Anthologies. He doesn't need to write these, only edit them and a few of them he isn't even the sole editor. He can kick out 4 or 5 of these a year easily. Quick and easy cash. I've always rejected the "recharging his batteries" argument because no one picks up a part-time job to relax. They do it for the money. Plain and simple.

The HBO series should, in theory, make him more money than all of his side projects put together. This opens the door to the possibility, that he doesn't need to work on the side-projects to keep Parris happy. Leaving him with more time to write his next novel. He also has a financial interest in staying ahead of the HBO series because he doesn't want the series to be canceled because they ran out of books, or worse if the series bypassed his books. That would create an odd situation where the series would become canon.

George is not going to be able to afford to be sidetracked by all those petty little projects that he's been working on in the past. I predict that in the coming years we'll see less and less of the "edited by George R.R. Martin" labels on books. He'll finish the books that he has agreed to edit and then that'll be it.

Winds of Winter will be completed in 3 years! What does Shawn Speakman always say? Own it? Own it! :D
Have any of you even considered that maybe George just isn't that good? That he got lucky with the first three books? That he had a great story leading up to the Red Wedding and the rest of the story he has no frickin' clue? haha Does that even cross your minds? ~ Shawn Speakman 1/31/2012
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby graff » Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:30 pm

With his signing tours it's going to be close to a year before he even gets started on TWoW, so one has to figure that in to the next release.

North America, Europe, and since he didn't do his Asian tour last time, you have to figure he'll be spending a couple months in China, Japan, and South Korea. Plus the second season of the HBO show will be in development, and he'll want a hand in that. Plus cons. And when he comes back there will be at least a few anthologies and Wild Cards books to catch up on.

By the time all that is done and he picks up the chapters he moved to the book from ADwD, he'll decide they're shit and rewrite them. There's no way actual *progress* gets made on TWoW until next summer IMO.

If HBO picks up a third season more time will be spent blogging casting clues and writing scripts (Martin will obviously want to do the Red Wedding and Tywin death episodes) and watching filming. So it's not like that's all going away. Writing an Ice & Fire book in just two years from next summer is a GRRM-sized stretch IMO.

None of that even takes into account the fact that George is now a personality in the television industry as well. I don't know what kind of cons they have, but there are awards and cocktail parties and shit that he will want to be a part of, plus a whole new pool of people that will want to meet and interview him.

There will also be people in the television and movie industry who will want to ride his name to a quick buck, so we'll get more mini-series, television movies, etc. of old work like Fevre Dream. Even if he works less on anthologies and Wild Cards, television-related stuff will replace some of that work time.

I understand what you're saying about the monetary aspect, but I just don't think money is all there is to him...George is a petulant little brat who seems to walk around with a huge chip on his shoulder. If he gets an opportunity to stick it to the people that have jilted him in the past then I believe he will do so.
"I recommended ASoIaF to a guy who's really been annoying me. I cannot describe how pleased I was when he said he'd check it out. It's like The Ring but the end of the tape is just NFL updates and posts about calendars." -Odrade at SA
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby kodali » Tue Apr 12, 2011 10:20 pm

What we have here is the glass half full and the glass half empty approach. I think things will probably fall somewhere in between the two. I do maintain, though, that with ADwD complete and whole scrapping of the gap behind him and caught up the journey to the end point (which apparently is Perth) should be smoother and therefore easier and quicker to write. We also have to do something to keep the god of procrastination away from George.
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby Key Lime Pie » Wed Apr 13, 2011 4:12 am

I think George will write books 6, 7, and 8 faster than book 5 (maybe three years per), but I don't really think it is about money. George likes editing because it does not require any actual work (which is why I did the editing in group projects in grad school) and he likes Wild Cards because he is a huge comic book geek who is unable to draw.

How deep in Book 3 is the Red Wedding? It would make a great season ending episode if they split the third book up (or if it is 2/3 into the book or further, season four could be the end of Storm Of Swords and the beginning of the combined Feast/Dragons).
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby Altraum » Wed Apr 13, 2011 11:42 am

Hoy,

I think that HBO will not increase the pace of writing. It would suprise me if the show isn't canceled before the 2nd next book is done. Imagine what that will do the Gorge's creativity when he gets the news. Months of pouting and leeching on the souls of his GRRMlins.

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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby scorpiknox » Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:08 pm

I went to a psychic and asked her about the future of the HBO show and GRRM's series*. She printed this out for me:


  • 2011

    • April 17th: Season one of A Game of Thrones premiers April 17th
    • April 24th: Second season of GoT is announced. Filming begins shortly thereafter.
    • July 3rd: Ned dies again. Season one ends.
    • July 12th: A Dance with Dragons is finally published (Just go with me here...)
    • July 13th: The sheer level of smug oozing off of the NaB crashes the internet for 17 hours.
    • July 18th: GRRM goes on 6 month book tour. Cannot write.
    • August 31st: Ty Frank wins a Hugo for his Space Opera, still works for GRRM due to poor sales.
    • October 12th: Adam "Werthead" White has sex with a woman for the very first time. Reviews his performance on The Wertzone.
    • November 23rd: GRRM blogs to let us know that he's having a great time in ___________. 100+ comments on NaB asking him when he'll be visiting _____________. Meanwhile, members of IWC tear their eyes out.

  • 2012

    • February 1st: It is now Black History Month. Damn the Man.
    • February 14th: GRRM concludes book tour. Has the crud. Cannot write.
    • February 15th: GRRM NaBs about getting caught up on the NFL. No spoilers!
    • February 19th: GoT Season 2 premiers, based on A Clash of Kings. (14 episodes.)
    • February 29th: GRRM gives Nab update confirming he's working on TWoW.
    • April 18: GRRM leaves for a well deserved vacation. Still hates flying. It's the seats, not his fat.
    • March 15th: Season 3 of GoT announced.
    • June 3rd: Season 2 of GoT concludes.
    • June 4th: GRRM returns home recharged and ready to rewrite all of his chapters.
    • July 6th: Ray officially renames his blog "Finish the Next Book, George."
    • August 12th: Elio Garcia Jr. finally has the operation. Congrats Elia!
    • August 31st: GRRM has a health scare wherein his beard becomes infected with jungle rot. This is highly unusual because he's normally a very healthy guy. No more twelve hour days for at least a year while GRRM learns the art of hygiene from the same guy who taught Nick Nolte how to bathe again. (He's very good.)
    • September 11: GRRM goes on one last vacation before the end of the world. Plans on returning home January 1st, 2013 "if there's a home to come back to..."

  • 2013

    • May 12th: Season 3 of GoT premiers. It will be based on the first half of A Storm of Swords. (12 Episodes)
    • May 30th: Season 4 of GoT announced.
    • June 6th: GRRM writes the watershed "To My Detractors II" wherein he singles out his editors by name. Neil Gaiman explodes in his tight, tight jeans.
    • August 11th: Season 3 of GoT concludes.
    • September 17th: Vacation! The Trans-Siberian railroad is lovely this time of year. Parris goes missing, murder mystery style. Turns out she was just stuck in the bathroom.
    • November 21st: GRRM comes back home in New Mexico. Finds pile of email oppressive, lets us all now about it. Repeated suggestions to buy a fucking laptop go unheeded. Finally someone explains what a laptop is and GRRM asks, "Why don't they call it a gut-top? I would buy one of those."
    • December 25th: GRRM throws back out lifting a bowl full of jelly.

  • 2014

    • January 17th: Shawn Speakman confidently declares that TWoW will be finished "at some point." Sites insider knowledge as proof.
    • June 8th: Season 4 of GoT Premiers (10 episodes).
    • June 22nd: Season 5 announced.
    • July 12th: Three year anniversary of the publication of A Dance with Dragons. Never forget.
    • August 1st: GRRM announces that The Winds of Winter is finished.
    • October 21st: The Winds of Winter is published. Only one more book to go! /wrists

*Vacations of less than a one month duration have been omitted for brevity.
1. This is a site dedicated to criticizing a handful of random people and one D list celebrity. The only way doing this is not pathetic is if you realize that it actually is kind of pathetic.

2. In 1977 GRRM's penis was dubbed "The Truffle" by a council of his peers because it is very hard to find and it attracts pigs.
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby Oliveira8 » Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:51 pm

Nice try but not enough vacations so I don't believe you or your psychic.
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby scorpiknox » Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:52 pm

For brevity I ommitted all vacations under a 1 month duration.
1. This is a site dedicated to criticizing a handful of random people and one D list celebrity. The only way doing this is not pathetic is if you realize that it actually is kind of pathetic.

2. In 1977 GRRM's penis was dubbed "The Truffle" by a council of his peers because it is very hard to find and it attracts pigs.
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby Lyle Gorch » Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:26 pm

Scorp...awesome. "Its the seats, not his fat" is just awesome-sauce.
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby kodali » Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:57 pm

I think I found 1 small mistake in there Scorp. I don't believe Ty is eligible for a Hugo this year, because Leviathan Wakes came out in 2011, he won't be eligible until 2012. Secondly it's a co written project, so he'd share it with Abraham. Being completely nerdy here the Hugo's are actually due to be presented on the 20th of August. I'm still waiting to see who made the cut, that comes out April 24.
What ADwD and AFfC do together, or rather are meant to do, is cover the events of the 5 year gap, greatly compressed now and make it possible for George to get things back on track. He hasn't mentioned the Knot forever, so I figure he may have solved that particular issue.
George's initial vision was a trilogy, he soon revised that to 4 books and then upped it to 6, he was stuck on 6 for a while and even had a bet with Parris that it would not go beyond 6, AFfC messed that up. It could go longer, he won't rule it out. The events of AGoT, ACoK and ASoS were the 1st book of the original trilogy, it was meant to end with The Red Wedding and then go into the 2nd book which was called amusingly enough A Dance with Dragons. Oh, you can learn a lot by listening to an author at a con.
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby scorpiknox » Wed Apr 13, 2011 11:39 pm

kodali wrote:I think I found 1 small mistake in there Scorp. I don't believe Ty is eligible for a Hugo this year, because Leviathan Wakes came out in 2011, he won't be eligible until 2012. Secondly it's a co written project, so he'd share it with Abraham. Being completely nerdy here the Hugo's are actually due to be presented on the 20th of August. I'm still waiting to see who made the cut, that comes out April 24.
What ADwD and AFfC do together, or rather are meant to do, is cover the events of the 5 year gap, greatly compressed now and make it possible for George to get things back on track. He hasn't mentioned the Knot forever, so I figure he may have solved that particular issue.
George's initial vision was a trilogy, he soon revised that to 4 books and then upped it to 6, he was stuck on 6 for a while and even had a bet with Parris that it would not go beyond 6, AFfC messed that up. It could go longer, he won't rule it out. The events of AGoT, ACoK and ASoS were the 1st book of the original trilogy, it was meant to end with The Red Wedding and then go into the 2nd book which was called amusingly enough A Dance with Dragons. Oh, you can learn a lot by listening to an author at a con.



She told me that her reading was for entertainment purposes only, but I think she's dead on. I mean, she had beads instead of a door at the entrance of her spirit room. So only Ty is going to get the Hugo. They awarded it to him because they at the HUGO Academy of Arts and Science Fictions hate the GRUM as much as we do. I don't even think any of the voters read Scoobie Doo and Zombie Space Opera or whatever it is called. They just voted Ty in.

The prophecy is written. Deal with it people.
1. This is a site dedicated to criticizing a handful of random people and one D list celebrity. The only way doing this is not pathetic is if you realize that it actually is kind of pathetic.

2. In 1977 GRRM's penis was dubbed "The Truffle" by a council of his peers because it is very hard to find and it attracts pigs.
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby Key Lime Pie » Thu Apr 14, 2011 3:04 am

Scorp, your predictions wounded me. From laughing so hard. The scary thing is how many of them will probably really happen.
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby scorpiknox » Thu Apr 14, 2011 4:00 am

Thanks Lyle and KLP!
1. This is a site dedicated to criticizing a handful of random people and one D list celebrity. The only way doing this is not pathetic is if you realize that it actually is kind of pathetic.

2. In 1977 GRRM's penis was dubbed "The Truffle" by a council of his peers because it is very hard to find and it attracts pigs.
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby Slynt » Thu Apr 14, 2011 6:35 am

Lol, that's the awesomest post on Is Winter Coming: Part III (or is it IV) anyway. The one we're at now.
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Re: Why HBO will help GRRM finish "Winds of Winter" ((Quickl

Postby silentmajority » Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:50 pm

Wouldn't you think that George, in a jealous rage, would fire Ty if he won a Hugo before he did? Just askin'.
Have any of you even considered that maybe George just isn't that good? That he got lucky with the first three books? That he had a great story leading up to the Red Wedding and the rest of the story he has no frickin' clue? haha Does that even cross your minds? ~ Shawn Speakman 1/31/2012
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